Month: January 2014

  • Answering the Liberal view of Jesus

    What follows is a Facebook conversation that I became involved in which I thought worth sharing. Since those involved have not given me permission to use their thoughts, I edited their names out so as to protect their identity. Likewise, this is an ongoing conversation, albeit very slowly. If more turns up, I will probably edit this piece to include those comments in the future.
    Kevin shared Daily Kos‘s photo.
    Zing!Thanks to Being Liberal for sharing.
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    • Alan —> Like it Bro!
    • Wayne Shuman And just where do you find this mysterious anti-war socialist Jesus??? I doubt the sign carrier has ever once looked at scripture or else they wouldn’t be saying such foolishness.
    • Wayne Shuman Oh and for the record… by the end of the New Testament times the “free health care” had pretty much ended. Thus why Paul would tell Timothy to take some wine for his “often sick stomach.”
    • Kevin —> did he have to pay for the wine?
    • Brian —> Wayne – not to stir a complete storm here, but are you saying that the Jesus you read about in your Scripture is pro-war, Capitalist, and did not cure people for free? I’m sorry, but I think the proof falls on your shoulders. I can readily dispense with a number of Scriptural lines showing Jesus supports people paying taxes, abhors free capitalism when it gets to its logical extremes (i.e. merchants in the temple), preaches non-violence, obedience to government (even in the face of execution), freely shares resources and shows compassion for the most poor, talks of worldly riches as an impediment to closeness with God, and heals people without ever charging a penny. Jesus never once that I have seen told people to go out and work to earn money – be like the lilies of the field, if I recall my lessons correctly. So prove me wrong…
    • Wayne Shuman Sorry for not having a quick response to your reply, Brian. I am a missionary in Southeast Asia and your daytime is my nighttime. I was asleep when you responded. But I have to say that you’ve thrown down the gauntlet and I am more than ready to reply…. having spent 35+ years studying scripture and even having gone to seminary to do so. For the record — any good Bible commentary will give you all of the information I’m expounding here…. Might I recommend finding a copy of Wycliffe’s Bible commentary or John MacArthur’s wonderful Bible commentaries. It would honestly help you to better understand what’s being said.

      (A) Scripture does actually say there is a time for war. That would be Ecclesiastes 3:8.

      Likewise, Jesus even used war as an example of just how we are to view the Christian life. (Luke 14:31-33) This would likewise explain why Paul tells the believer to put on the armor of God. (Galatians 6:13-17) and as well, why Paul would even use the word “Soldier” as a synonym for believers. (2 Timothy 2:3-10)

      God often used war for two reasons (A) to cleanse the land of EVIL men such as the Philistines, Moabites, Edomites, etc. and (B.) to punish Israel themselves for their own sins. (God would call upon other nations to go to war against Israel for just this purpose.) So there is a time and a right cause for war, and scripture constantly affirms this. Whenever evil reigns, good men are not to stand idly by.

      So war did / does have purpose in God’s economy — and Jesus did acknowledge that by the use of it in example during his preaching. It may well be said that sinful men are generally the aggressor, primarily because of their sin, be it greed, lust for power, or whatever other selfish reason might drive them…. but God does use these things to His purpose and for His glory when they come about. That is why God is sovereign over His creation. And just as often God did call Israel to war, as stated previously.

      (B) Capitalism. My point here was that Jesus did not come to set up ANY political system, be it socialism, capitalism, democracy or communism.

      Jesus came to call all men to bow their knees to him — at the cost of their very lives if necessary. (Matthew 10:34-39) As Peter puts it, Believers are “strangers, living in a strange land.” Foreigners to this world. Our allegiance is not to the kingdoms of this Earth, but to the kingdom that is to come where Jesus will rule supreme. That is what makes a man a Christian — and all these other systems will someday bow to that other kingdom and fall away.As a point in fact regarding wealth — Proverbs 22:2 The rich and the poor have this in common, God is the maker of both. If you would say “Yeah, well, he’s their creator, nothing more” — Ecclesiastes 5:19 specifically states that God makes some men wealthy for their toil and efforts. It’s His sovereign right to do so as God. Thus even capitalism plays it’s part in God’s molding of men’s lives…. if you want to press the point. Likewise 1 Samuel 2:7. But the point of wealth is not so that we would worship it, but that we would rather use it for helping others and to bring Glory to God. Thus why Jesus would say “No man can serve two masters.” and be referring specifically to money. I love Proverbs 30:8-9 Give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me only my daily bread. Otherwise, I may have too much and disown you and say, “Who is the Lord?” Or I may become poor and steal, and so dishonor the name of my God. — I make that my prayer often.

      (C) Free health care. Hmmmm, not that hard to dismiss. Jesus never went into a single hospital and emptied it of it’s patients. Neither did the Apostles that followed after him during the founding of the Church.

      ALL miracles had specific purpose —- to point back to Christ as the messiah that Israel had been looking for for nearly 2000 years AT THAT POINT. The messiah had originally been promised as far back as Adam and Eve. Pointed to again under Moses. Pointed to yet again under the judges and then King David. Pointed to yet further under the latter prophets….. and finally the last of those prophets, John the Baptist, pointed yet again and said “Here he is”. Every miracle Jesus performed had SPECIFIC intent. Thus — Jesus did not heal EVERY individual He encountered, and even one town it specifically states this. (Mark 6:5) And neither did the apostles…. and such “free healings” were only limited to the time of both. At the end of that time, when the scriptures had been written — there no longer was a necessity of validating the messenger… the very point the miracles were supposed to have. (For the record, I despise and disclaim all so-called ‘faith-healers’ of our day as fakes and frauds and not working under the power of God.)

      Point of fact — Even the healings weren’t “free” … that is to say without command. Jesus often, very often, told the individual that He healed — “Go, and sin no more.” and even told one man that should he continue the way he had WORSE would yet come upon him. (John 5:15) (BTW: in that account there were MANY people sick…. but Jesus only healed ONE of them…. pointing to exactly what I have been saying; the miracles were for specific purpose.)

      So point of fact, yes Jesus healed. Yes Jesus accepted no money for those healings. But No, Jesus did NOT heal everyone. Jesus did not set up a “Health-care plan” or a system or even a general hospital in His name. Jesus did NOT even try to on either count. Nor did He command that this should be done for the rest of all time. Every healing he performed had specific intent of pointing him out to be Israel’s messiah. He simply healed, and called men to repentance.

      But unless you repent, you too will all perish. (Luke 13:3)

    • Wayne Shuman (D) The merchants at the temple. Easily enough explained — Because Jesus, HIMSELF, explained why.

      “Get these things out of here. Stop turning my Father’s house into a marketplace!” (John 2:16)

      There were two occasions where this happened, once at the beginning of Jesus ministry (John 2) and once at the end (recorded in all 4 gospels). But there was a common thread — both times were SPECIFICALLY at the Jewish Passover festival. Every other time Jesus went to the temple he didn’t bother the buyers and sellers that were there (and they were there daily!!!). So you have to ask yourself — why only these two times?

      Jesus was against two specific things here. 1st the fact that these men had taken a commandment from God (re: Deuteronomy 14:24-26) and used it to become EXTORTIONISTS by robbing the people of their money by selling either inferior animals (the animals to be used were supposed to be “without spot or blemish” Leviticus 1:3; Exodus 12:5 —- because they were supposed to be a picture of Christ, who without sin died as a scapegoat for the believer’s sin. 1 Peter 1:19 & Hebrews 9:13-14) or by charging 3x – 10x’s what they were worth in market value SPECIFICALLY AGAINST other commands of the Jewish law against extortion and usury. (Exodus 22:25, likewise Leviticus, Deuteronomy, Psalms, Proverbs, Isaiah & Ezekiel)

      2ndly specifically where this had happened. The temple was SUPPOSED to represent the holiness of God to the people — but men had turned it into nothing more than a den of thieves. Men had denigrated the God of this Universe down to nothing more than an object for their own carnal pleasures. What was supposed to be a place of prayer and seeking after God had become a place of evil. This was pointed out in Matthew 21:13, Mark 11:17 and likewise Luke 19:46 — all of which are the second time he cleared the temple —- which all state: ‘My house shall be called a house of prayer for all the nations’ (<—quoting Isaiah 56:7 and pairing it with Jeremiah 7:11 —>) But you have made it a den of robbers.”

      That said we see that Jesus ONLY did so at the temple and ONLY did so at the passover and ONLY did so with specific cause …. not to make a political statement about capitalism, but rather to expel the evil men from their mockery of the place God’s holiness was supposed to be recognized by all of Israel.

      Thus Jesus wasn’t against the buying and selling of things at a profit… if he were against that He could have easily reprimanded the fisherman, farmers & shepherds or cattlemen of His day for doing the very same thing … selling things at a profit.Yes Jesus supported taxation… no question there. I’ll take it a step further — you’re called to obey the government over you in as far as they don’t FORCE you to disobey God’s commands. (Romans 13:1-7; Acts 4:18-20) That means as long as Obama is in office… He’s there because GOD put him there, not because you voted him in. (Romans 13:1; Daniel 4:17, 25, 32 & 5:21 — & Proverbs 21:1) God has a purpose and a plan for Him being there, like it or not…. even if it is to bring or exact punishment for the sins America has committed against God. (which it may well be, I’m just saying.) So whether we like Obama or not… he’s in office for a reason… to God’s purpose and plan which will always be enacted.

      Lastly (E) Jesus may have not said much about men working to gain their keep — but scripture does, and Jesus did affirm the trustworthiness of scripture. Before we get to that, though, you MIS-applied the lilies of the field verse. Here’s the context — stop worrying about your next meal and start trusting that God has it already in His control. (Matthew 6:24-35 paraphrased. In specific He states: “But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.” harkening directly to what I said.)

      If a man does not work, he should not eat. (2 Thessalonians 3:10) It’s an established precedent going all the way back to the fall of mankind in the Garden of Eden and the punishment of men for their sin.

      Cursed is the ground because of you;
      through painful toil you will eat food from it
      all the days of your life.
      It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
      and you will eat the plants of the field.
      By the sweat of your brow
      you will eat your food (Genesis 3:17-19)

      There is plenty that the scriptures say about men working to earn their wages — it’s even used as a parallel for grace being the sole means of man’s salvation — For the WAGES of sin is death, but the GIFT of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus. Wages are something you earn… thus your death comes upon you because you’ve sinned against God, it’s the final payment for all the rebellion you’ve enacted throughout your whole life — unless you turn to Christ and repent.

      Proverbs 28:13 — he who denies his sin shall not prosper, but whoever confesses and forsakes it shall obtain Mercy.

    • Jeff —> Wasn’t it Jesus who healed lepers for free… and said love thy neighbor as thyself… I don’t care about what was written before or after he was here, just how he lived… and I feel he would look at the divided church and say that we all are missing the point.
    • Brian —> Wayne – thanks for the detailed responses, I greatly appreciate it. I apologize for the delay in my reply; I have been pretty sick for the past two weeks so I’ve been sporadically online.

      I greatly admire that you are a missionary; I have several friends who have gone down that path and served in a variety of countries, and it is a great calling, and one that has done a lot of good in the world. Not to be too snarky – but it also a rich tradition of Christians providing free healthcare and education.

    • Wayne Shuman Brian, sad to hear of your illness, what was it that had you down for 2 weeks? I am not being sarcastic here, I’m being genuinely concerned. If it’s still hanging on, I would have no problem praying for that for you.

      As to my being a missionary — please do understand… I don’t buy into the whole “Social reforms to change the world” bent of modern liberalism and the social-gospel folks. I personally know that to change a man’s circumstances does NOTHING to change his actual problem(s) — which would generally be his sin and rebellion against God.

      When I speak of being a missionary I specifically mean it in the classical sense of “teaching people that Jesus Christ alone will save them, if they renounce their idolatry (be it classical as in the sense of Taiwan’s many Buddhist temples which represent an abomination to the one true God or modern in the sense of men worshiping their cars, their women, their booze or their football team) and turn in repentance for having lived ALL their lives in rebellion to God.” I speak of being a missionary in the sense that I am here to PREACH the gospel, not simply give men a meal, some health care & a nice pat on the back and falsely tell them “it will be OK…. just give it time.”

      Romans 3:10-18 (Paraphrased and with 3:23 added) NO MAN seeks after God…. not a single person on the planet… they have all chased after the vanity of idols and become worthless before God. Thus have ALL men sinned and fallen short of God’s standard… a standard that they do all they can to ignore or excuse themselves from.

      I am a missionary who believes that ONLY — O-N-L-Y — belief (RE: complete abandonment to, wholehearted trust in God’s way of viewing things — and when the bible speaks to “heart” it doesn’t mean your emotions as the modern understanding lends to, but everything within a man that leads him to make an active decision, that is to say his entire thinking process) in the Gospel of Christ will change a man… everything else fails because it does not address the root problem of man’s condition: Sin.

      And ONLY those who believe in that gospel will ultimately be saved from the coming wrath of God…. something else that Jesus pointed to but we like to ignore. That’s a pointed remark to Jeff’s comment. Jesus didn’t come to live a perfect life as an EXAMPLE for men to follow — Jesus came to pay the price of men’s sin, if they will admit freely, openly and clearly before God and men that they are in fact gross transgressors of God’s law. Jesus, himself, said it best: Think not that I came to call the (self) righteous men to God, but rather I came to call sinners to repentance. (Mark 2:17; Luke 5:32 as compared with John 9:39-41 & Luke 18:9-14 — all the words of Jesus for you, Jeff.)

      Now that all said (which is negative) let me be positive. Salvation is free. Salvation is the free grace of God given to any man who will accept it as the gift it is and stop trying to foolishly earn some sort of respect before God by what they assume is “good deeds” that they’ve done. Salvation comes simply by trust / by faith / by belief in the transforming message of the gospel (Romans 1:15-16) and the only “righteous” men on the whole planet are those people who have surrendered themselves to Christ’s perfection and stopped trying to claim that they themselves are allegedly so. That goes back to the whole “I did not come to call the (self) righteous, but sinners to repentance.” comment of Jesus.

      For without faith it is IMPOSSIBLE to please God. (Hebrews 11:6)

      Now, that said, do you really still admire me as a missionary since my aim is so singular as to call every other religion on the planet (including atheism which is literally the worship of self or of mankind in place of God) ‘idolatry’ and Christianity as the only means of a man’s redemption before God?

  • Reasons why Roman Catholicism is heresy

    Recently I was asked to explain why Roman Catholicism fell under the umbrella of a heretical cult rather than a Christian Religion. While it is true that they have a thin veneer of Christian terminology and practice, under the cloak lies blasphemies so foul that it is no wonder God used Rome as a metaphor for the Whore of Babylon in Revelation. Here was my response to the question. I’m honestly hoping that Cut and paste will work here without me having to type in scores of HTML coding.

    For the record, my list is actually sequential with the most heretical reasons being at number 1 and proceeding down from there. So Number 1 really is the Number 1 reason why Rome fails as an honest Christian endeavor.

    (1) Above all else — denial of the sufficiency of Christ’s substitutionary death. One only has to review the doctrine of the Mass to understand what I mean here. To the Catholic system — Christ died to BEGIN a system of DAILY sacrifices upon the ALTAR of the MASS. Thus they claim that Christ’s death wasn’t sufficient for us — Blasphemy of blasphemies…. to tell Jesus that his death wasn’t enough.

    (2) The placing a man at the head of Christ’s Church — The pope did not die for the sins of the world, neither does he supplant Christ in role of leadership. A body can only have ONE head. That is Christ, as rightly defined by Scripture.

    (3) Idolatry. Be it Mary or saints. Be it graven images or apparitions. The dominant theme recurring in the Roman Catholic Heresy is the idolatrous worship of CREATED things in place of God. They even worship the wafer they assume carries the physical properties of Christ…. and tell men that this is right, holy and just for men to do and if you disagree — Curse you to hell.

    (4) The replacement of salvation by faith through Grace with a works based system. No man can buy off God no matter how many Hail Mary’s he has performed. (Pssst….. Mary doesn’t hear your prayers by the way…) Ephesians 2:8-10 should easily dispel any question, but if you must, then review Galatians 3 & 4… for some real eye-openers on works based religions.

    (5) The rejection of scripture as the sole basis of attaining a knowledge of God. Gaze deeply into yourself and listen for the voice of God…. yeah…. right. The Catholic mystics are a demonically inspired lot if ever there was one. God calls us to look to Scripture to hear his calling upon us, as well as for us to learn who He is and what He desires of us.

    (5.1) The rejection of the AUTHORITY of Scripture upon the believer. In it’s place they would assume the AUTHORITY of the Church, it’s priests, Bishops, Cardinals & Popes.

    (5.2) The rejection of the FINALITY of scripture, as written. Sorry, When the Pope speaks Ex Cathedra, it’s meaningless to the true child of God. The Pope would do well to remember the warnings of Revelation 22:18-19.

    (6) The reinstatement of the Jewish priestly system, complete with daily sacrifices. Why else do you think they put so much stock into their priests and Mass. Christ did away with the whole matter when he said “It is finished” and sat down at the right hand of the Father. Now we are A-L-L priests, and there is no need for repeated sacrifices. Catholics would do well to read the book of Hebrews and 1 Peter.

    (7) Purgatory…. the damnable heresy that men have a second chance after death, despite Hebrews 9:27. I wonder how many billions of deceived men and women will sadly awaken to find that that lake of fire is eternal…. not temporary.

    (8) The placement of Mary into the position of affecting our salvation. Forget all the other Mary-dolatry…. this one thing alone is the gravest. For there is ONE MEDIATOR between God and man, Christ Jesus. To deny this —- is to deny the honest means of our salvation. To place a human between Christ’s atoning work and our acceptance before the Father is utter blasphemy.

    That’s the top 10…. but I’m sure the list could be expanded greatly.

    Rome hasn’t changed — because — Rome believes it’s self to be perfection… and you don’t change perfection. Thus when the Vatican 2 Council sat — they changed nothing of the anathemas called down upon honest Christians from the Council of Trent. All they did was change the language.